Five aggregates and the omnipresent mental factors

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Home Forums Discussion topics In-Depth Meditation Training (EN) Five aggregates and the omnipresent mental factors

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    • #1729
      Ven. Gendun
      Keymaster

      How do the five aggregates relate to the five omnipresent mental factors?

      • This topic was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by Ven. Gendun.
      • This topic was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by Ven. Gendun.
      • This topic was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by Ven. Gendun.
      • This topic was modified 9 months, 3 weeks ago by Ven. Gendun.
    • #2176
      Maureen Chalfen
      Participant

      Dear Venerable,

      I have been grappling with my understanding of the five aggregates in relation to the five omnipresent mental factors, as there is some overlap in terms (such as feeling). My sense is that the five aggregates speak to the broader context of all human experience while the 5 omnipresent mental factors speak more to our personal experience, but I am not sure that is correct. How should I reflect on these two important topics?

      Thank you,

      Maureen

      • #2182
        Ven. Gendun
        Keymaster

        Hi Maureen,
        These are two different lists for two different purposes.
        The omnipresent mental factors are five aspects of all minds, among 51, that give basic explanation of how awareness functions.
        The five aggregates are a comprehensive description of a psycho-physical being, but from a meditators perspective.

        I can highly recommend:
        Approaching the Buddhist Path: The Library of Wisdom and Compassion, by His Holiness the Dalai Lama and Ven. Thubten Chodron
        …as a source to investigate these basic topics deeper

    • #2240
      Petra Ardai
      Participant

      Dear Ven. Gendun,

      I can’t really find the words, although it’s clear that there’s a strong relationship between the aggregates and the omnipresent mental factors. It seems to me that the 5 aggregates are (sense) manifestations of the experience (of the mind) while the omnipresent mental factors are actions of the mind perceiving the experience. Am I on the right path?

      • #2364
        Ven. Gendun
        Keymaster

        No, in fact three of the omnipresent mental factors are also aggregates and two are contained in the aggregate of volitional formations (attention and contact)

    • #2256
      Katja Sienknecht
      Participant

      Ik denk, dat de aggregaten door ons worden waargenomen, onderscheiden en gevoeld met behulp van de vijf alom tegenwoordige mentale factoren.

      • #2366
        Ven. Gendun
        Keymaster

        The two categories overlap, see above.

      • #2367
        Ven. Gendun
        Keymaster

        The two categories overlap, see above.

    • #2263
      Sara Caldwell
      Participant

      Dear Ven. Gendun,
      I can’t tell you how grateful I am that you are sharing your wisdom and experience in such a generous and accessible way. I am overjoyed to join this training.
      This is a very tricky question to think about. I think that Form arises from one or more of the 4 elements and the Consciousnesses arise from the other aggregates coming into Contact with particular Forms. Mental factors arise when Consciousness comes into Contact with the other aggregates. Contact / Perception leads to Feeling which, due to Mental Formations, leads to Intention, which directs Attention.
      Is this on the right track at all?
      With profound gratitude,
      Sara Caldwell

      • #2365
        Ven. Gendun
        Keymaster

        Almost right. In case of the sensory consciousnesses it is indeed the case that they arise in relation to form, but that is not the case necessarily for mental consciousness. For example when the arise in relation to a concept (a non-associated compositional factor).

    • #2382
      Ven. Gendun
      Keymaster

      Great discussions. I hope you find it helpful to explore the topics together!

    • #2181
      Maureen Chalfen
      Participant

      Thank you, Gendun. Got it. Very clear now. I have ordered the recommended text and look forward to going deeper.

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